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Post by Steelers 1954 on Aug 31, 2019 18:56:25 GMT -5
If you have something like 4th, 5th, and 6th cuz it defeats the whole purpose of a keeper league, Not so sure about that but we can change them to QB/RB 6th,WR 7th & TE 8th if that's what everyone wants. If we run into problems we had at the CTM then we can readjust the values.
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Post by Divebitch on Aug 31, 2019 19:20:18 GMT -5
If you have something like 4th, 5th, and 6th cuz it defeats the whole purpose of a keeper league, Not so sure about that but we can change them to QB/RB 6th,WR 7th & TE 8th if that's what everyone wants. If we run into problems we had at the CTM then we can readjust the values. Actually, I didn't mind the values where they were, it felt like a reward - but I think the 6-7-8 is conservative enough, especially if we get rid of keeping any higher round tags. Also thought the same thing, we can always readjust the values. Hopefully by mid-season or earlier, cuz we keep hurt guys around that we might otherwise drop based on keeper settings.
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Post by Divebitch on Dec 13, 2019 20:01:24 GMT -5
Okay, I just posted to ADB in the Hive league
"Okay, I get Rule 6, but not 6A. And IDK how the same can apply to WRs. We shall revisit, so don't disappear. This is everyone's league. Oh, I see it's 3 keepers now. If it's something like you keep a QB and 2 RBs, 2 of them become your 4th & 5th, that is absurd IMO." And... "Just glad we got rid of the crazy late round tags that lasted for the duration of a player's career, like a L Bell or R Wilson @ 12th."
Here's basically where I stand.... Everything I said above. Tags go back to round 6-7-8 after max keep. But I think (and this may be a huge PITA to keep track of), but maybe they should retain the tag to trade when they still have a year left. And please explain 6A, cuz if means that your keepers head in the opposite (lower) direction, I'm not for that at all. It makes no sense. There's almost no benefit to a keeper league, with the values pared down to oblivion. The only benefit is if you found an incredible sleeper worthy of a 1st thru 3rd or 4th round. In a 10 teamer, that is highly unlikely. Speaking for myself, I had the forethought to get Kareem Hunt 11th and stash him 10 wks. Sanders in the 13th. My 4th and 5th rounders (Aaron Jones and Lindsay), well I can only keep 1 with a two-RB max. And this is all they are worth, especially Lindsay. And I picked Melvin Gordon up off the WW, but he becomes a 5th?!??! No freaking way. That should be a 7th, IOW, just the way it worked before, except 1 round earlier.
All of that stuff is beyond a compromise. And I posted it Aug 31, and not fully addressed, the business of a 2nd RB and a QB becoming a 4th or 5th. .
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Post by Steelers 1954 on Dec 14, 2019 14:55:11 GMT -5
Okay everybody don't get into a dizzy, I fixed Rule 6a. I forgot to update the values it has now been corrected.
The players you draft and choose to keep will be in the round you drafted them. If you don't keep any of the players you drafted and instead keep 2 RB's from the FA list the 1st will be a 6th round pick the 2nd will be a 7th round pick. If you choose to keep 2 WR's from the FA list the 1st will be a 7th round pick and the 2nd will be an 8th round pick.
The values QB/RB 6th round,WR 7th round and TE 8th round are for players from the Free Agent/ Waiver Wire only and does not affect the players you drafted or the position you drafted them in.
To answer your question Dive the answer would be no. If you were lucky enough to draft a player in say the 10th round and you trade him to someone else with a year left, if he has out performed where he was drafted his draft value will be adjusted before the new owner has him on their team. Why should they benefit from your good fortune of drafting them late when everyone else passed them over,we would run into the same problems we had in the CTM if we let them have that late draft value.
There is a new rule that covers the late round drafted players and what will happen when they need to be traded. See *Rule 8
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Post by Divebitch on Dec 14, 2019 19:07:17 GMT -5
Okay everybody don't get into a dizzy, I fixed Rule 6a. I forgot to update the values it has now been corrected. The players you draft and choose to keep will be in the round you drafted them. If you don't keep any of the players you drafted and instead keep 2 RB's from the FA list the 1st will be a 6th round pick the 2nd will be a 7th round pick. If you choose to keep 2 WR's from the FA list the 1st will be a 7th round pick and the 2nd will be an 8th round pick. The values QB/RB 6th round,WR 7th round and TE 8th round are for players from the Free Agent/ Waiver Wire only and does not affect the players you drafted or the position you drafted them in.To answer your question Dive the answer would be no. If you were lucky enough to draft a player in say the 10th round and you trade him to someone else with a year left, if he has out performed where he was drafted his draft value will be adjusted before the new owner has him on their team. Why should they benefit from your good fortune of drafting them late when everyone else passed them over,we would run into the same problems we had in the CTM if we let them have that late draft value.There is a new rule that covers the late round drafted players and what will happen when they need to be traded. See *Rule 8 Okay, most of it sounds fabulous, especially the rule 6. One rule that just needs simple clarification (I hope): "7.) Any player traded for or acquired thru FA or WW after week 1 can be assigned the keeper tag up to 2 times" Maybe further go on to say, the player can be kept once if drafted (that means 2 full years), or twice if you picked him up after week 1 (which would be anywhere from 2 yrs & a week to yrs and 15 wks. "8.) Players drafted in the late rounds can be kept by the owner who drafted them. If that player is traded and has out performed the round he was drafted in he will have his draft value adjusted before he gets trade to the new owner." It should be obvious a player can be kept by the person that drafted them, so that's confusing. WE should be able to trade him for the round he was drafted in, and only for that player's 1 yr, not 2. It would be nothing like CTM where their values carried over year after year after year. Maybe you didn't understand what I meant. That would be part of the purpose of trading. Why on earth would anyone wanna trade a great player (for example, like Kareem Hunt drafted 12th) to someone else who'd only get to gonna keep him as a 6th or 7th rounder? What kinda return what I get for that? And again, IDK if you got this, but the person I'd trade him to couldn't keep him a 2nd time at 12th round, just the 1 yr after the trade.
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Post by Steelers 1954 on Dec 15, 2019 6:05:31 GMT -5
It should be obvious a player can be kept by the person that drafted them, so that's confusing Confusing? It shouldn't be. Okay so maybe wrong wording: Players drafted in the late rounds that are kept by the owner will keep the round they were drafted in until player must be dropped or traded. If that player is traded and has out performed the round he was drafted in he will have his draft value adjusted before he gets traded to the new owner. WE should be able to trade him for the round he was drafted in, and only for that player's 1 yr, not 2. Why should someone else reap the benefits because you took a late round pick an they played very well when everyone else passed on that player. If that happens the next thing you know the owner you traded him to will want the full 2 years. It would be nothing like CTM It could be just not as bad. We are trying to avoid the problems we had in the CTM not follow down the same path.
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Post by Steelers 1954 on Dec 15, 2019 6:30:19 GMT -5
All or most have played together in a keeper league for some time now and for the most part we have used basically the same rules for our keeper leagues. Some of the rules have changed for this new keeper league because we don't want to have or make the same mistakes we had in those other leagues. I know some were not here this off season and did not voice their views but most of us were here and agreed we needed to address some issues about the keepers. If we can ever get everyone here and someone has a better solution to solve the keeper issues then we can/will make changes to what the majority wants.
I only did what I did so that we had some kinda starting point about the keepers, I did use what little input I did get from the people that were around during the off season.
As for the score settings yes we can make changes to make the defenses have a little more value if that's what everyone wants. If you want to have higher scoring games we can easily do that by changing the the score settings at some or all the positions.
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Post by Divebitch on Dec 15, 2019 10:20:30 GMT -5
It should be obvious a player can be kept by the person that drafted them, so that's confusing Confusing? It shouldn't be. Okay so maybe wrong wording: Players drafted in the late rounds that are kept by the owner will keep the round they were drafted in until player must be dropped or traded. If that player is traded and has out performed the round he was drafted in he will have his draft value adjusted before he gets traded to the new owner. WE should be able to trade him for the round he was drafted in, and only for that player's 1 yr, not 2. Why should someone else reap the benefits because you took a late round pick an they played very well when everyone else passed on that player. If that happens the next thing you know the owner you traded him to will want the full 2 years.Still not sure what you mean by 'outperformed'? Do you mean his 2 full years was up (I get that), or do you mean he played better than the 12th round he was drafted in? Then of course he would have to get readjusted. Are you saying that we must ask ourselves if that player (like a L. Bell in his prime, top 5 overall pick) should even be allowed to be kept as a 6th or 7th rounder? I still feel a player should retain the late tag for the 2nd full year of keeping. As far as people wanting to keep the trade bait for an extra year (making it 2), we simply say 'no, tough'. We urge everyone to read the rules, ask questions, and remind them of their trade implications. This will of course be easier in the off-season, as it's all manual, and the trades are announced here. Second time you mention 'why should someone else reap the benefits of your fortuitous late round pick?' Don't forget that the person who trades that player also reaps the reward of a better deal. For instance, I drafted Sanders in the 13th. So if I trade him in Jan, I might be eyeing your Devin Singletary 11th (vs. your Dalvin Cook in what would be an early 2nd round). Just examples, I wouldn't expect Singletary. lol Perhaps the point is moot, as you wouldn't want to trade a great late rounder anyone. But it might come into play more frequently being you can't keep 3 RBs or WRs anymore. Also, has it been addressed what happens to a 1st year trade (like this off-season), where say I trade Sanders for Neil's Josh Jacob a 4th? Are we really gonna make him even better now, by giving Jacobs a 6th round tag? SOLD!!! lol Or hey, make your D Cook a 6th rounder too, I'll take that deal instead. Or do we say anyone with a low round keeps the tag, and those that were drafted later forfeit that tag and return to 6th or 7th? If not, don't think it's anyone's place to decide or vote what that new trade value should be. That's a ginormous can of worms, unfair, and highly impractical - so I doubt that's what you mean. That's why keeping the tag a 2nd time, no matter if traded or not. Only issue I can see is it might be hard to keep track of down the road, like 2021 & beyond. All or most have played together in a keeper league for some time now and for the most part we have used basically the same rules for our keeper leagues. Some of the rules have changed for this new keeper league because we don't want to have or make the same mistakes we had in those other leagues. I know some were not here this off season and did not voice their views but most of us were here and agreed we needed to address some issues about the keepers. If we can ever get everyone here and someone has a better solution to solve the keeper issues then we can/will make changes to what the majority wants. I only did what I did so that we had some kinda starting point about the keepers, I did use what little input I did get from the people that were around during the off season. As for the score settings yes we can make changes to make the defenses have a little more value if that's what everyone wants. If you want to have higher scoring games we can easily do that by changing the the score settings at some or all the positions. Yeah, it would be great to get everyone, or least 8 of us in here. Neil will come if ya press him. I told ADB in the league chat to not disappear. Maybe we should send out an email this week thru the league, and ask to check in here, and discuss. I think the league went great, just needs a couple tweaks, IMO. I hated the H2H before. Still not crazy about it, but don't hate it. lol It's fine, and something that can be addressed anytime in any off-season - unlike keepers, which we've really gotta reach a consensus and get on the same page on with the details. BTW, this Chip, he's never been here, right? Hasn't done an add/drop since 11/13, nor made even a roster adjustment since 12/2. Should we see if he still wants to be in the league? Has he ever talked there?
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Post by Steelers 1954 on Dec 16, 2019 9:43:04 GMT -5
or do you mean he played better than the 12th round he was drafted in? Yes exactly what I meant. I still feel a player should retain the late tag for the 2nd full year of keeping. If you are the one who drafted him he will retain the late tag for as long as you are allowed to keep him. Once that time is up and he needs to be traded his value will be adjusted before the new owner has control of that player,or he is simply dropped back into the player list. Also, has it been addressed what happens to a 1st year trade (like this off-season), where say I trade Sanders for Neil's Josh Jacob a 4th? Are we really gonna make him even better now, by giving Jacobs a 6th round tag? SOLD!!! lol Or hey, make your D Cook a 6th rounder too, No those drafted in the early rounds will keep the round they were drafted in. Only those drafted in the late rounds will be adjusted if/when they need to be.
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Post by Steelers 1954 on Dec 16, 2019 10:16:53 GMT -5
Also, has it been addressed what happens to a 1st year trade At this point no it hasn't been addressed but is something we can talk about. I still feel a player should retain the late tag for the 2nd full year of keeping. As far as people wanting to keep the trade bait for an extra year (making it 2), we simply say 'no, tough'. We urge everyone to read the rules, ask questions, and remind them of their trade implications If we do that we are going down the same road we've already been on and almost everyone has said they don't want that in the Hive. Not everyone has read the rules. Trust me someone will at some point bitch about not being able to keep the player with the late round tag for a full 2 years. BTW, this Chip, he's never been here, right? Hasn't done an add/drop since 11/13, nor made even a roster adjustment since 12/2. Should we see if he still wants to be in the league? Has he ever talked there? As far as I know he hasn't been here. Yeah I see that he still has A.Jeffrey in his line-up who's on IR. As far as I know he hasn't said anything on the league chat either. I wonder if he truly understands about keepers, he traded away some good players for next to nothing. I know someone who might be interested if he needs replaced.
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Post by Divebitch on Dec 16, 2019 10:35:51 GMT -5
Also, has it been addressed what happens to a 1st year trade At this point no it hasn't been addressed but is something we can talk about. I still feel a player should retain the late tag for the 2nd full year of keeping. As far as people wanting to keep the trade bait for an extra year (making it 2), we simply say 'no, tough'. We urge everyone to read the rules, ask questions, and remind them of their trade implications If we do that we are going down the same road we've already been on and almost everyone has said they don't want that in the Hive. Not everyone has read the rules. Trust me someone will at some point bitch about not being able to keep the player with the late round tag for a full 2 years. BTW, this Chip, he's never been here, right? Hasn't done an add/drop since 11/13, nor made even a roster adjustment since 12/2. Should we see if he still wants to be in the league? Has he ever talked there? As far as I know he hasn't been here. Yeah I see that he still has A.Jeffrey in his line-up who's on IR. As far as I know he hasn't said anything on the league chat either. I wonder if he truly understands about keepers, he traded away some good players for next to nothing. I know someone who might be interested if he needs replaced. Yeah, I later noticed the same thing, Alshon Jeffery on IR for the past 2 weeks. This dude's gotta go IMO. This is too special a league for that. And the keeper aspect has implications for the rest of us. If you're not gonna participate in some kinda comradery, at least play your best. I think we should actually talk soon about the trade after 1 year, cuz I still don't think we're understanding each other - so it might be quicker and easier. And it would be fun.
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Post by Jeppers on Dec 16, 2019 10:47:49 GMT -5
If I wasn’t confused before....Iam now. Haha
Chip was frustrated at not doing well in the league. He doesn’t like the locked waivers and a few other things he’s not used to. He didn’t want to give up and let it beat him but not sure if he wants to continue or not. I believe he’s forgot about this league as he is in others. I will talk to him
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Post by Jeppers on Dec 16, 2019 10:48:52 GMT -5
I warned him that it was a very competitive league. Haha
I guess he found out just how much
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Post by Divebitch on Dec 16, 2019 10:57:46 GMT -5
If I wasn’t confused before....Iam now. Haha Chip was frustrated at not doing well in the league. He doesn’t like the locked waivers and a few other things he’s not used to. He didn’t want to give up and let it beat him but not sure if he wants to continue or not. I believe he’s forgot about this league as he is in others. I will talk to him Locked waivers? Ya mean til WW Wednesday? What kinda leagues is that not practiced at? lol I warned him that it was a very competitive league. Haha I guess he found out just how much Yeah, there are really no slouches whatsoever @ the Hive. It's just so great that (well, except for Chip) it's all OGs, like from 9 years ago. Dirtybird As long as you're checking in, how about it? Any issues, comments? Discuss. lol
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Post by Jeppers on Dec 16, 2019 12:48:50 GMT -5
Locked waivers? Ya mean til WW Wednesday? What kinda leagues is that not practiced at? lol MFL leagues are like that. And some yahoo leagues too. One yahoo league Im in there are no locks on players.
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Post by Divebitch on Dec 16, 2019 14:35:07 GMT -5
Locked waivers? Ya mean til WW Wednesday? What kinda leagues is that not practiced at? lol MFL leagues are like that. And some yahoo leagues too. One yahoo league Im in there are no locks on players. Well, you can do it in NFL too, it's just a setting the LM picks. So you gotta be logged in all the time, probably with audible pings every time a transaction occurs, so you can swoop in on that Buffalo D DB dropped. We don't need no stinkin' WW priority. wtf No one with a job could win that league. So you quit your job for it, or in last place? lol EDIT: Warning!! You are coming up on your 1000th post. Don't recall you being big on poetry, but ya know, just try.
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larryb
Junior Member
Posts: 26
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Post by larryb on Dec 16, 2019 19:30:32 GMT -5
I read all the information and I agree. Larryb
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